Seiko 7A38 - by the numbers

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Forum Home > eBay, LeBonCoin, Mercado Libre, Yahoo Japan, etc. > Beware the Gender Bender - this is a Kamatz LADY's watch !

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11495

This came up in my saved eBay favourite search notifications this morning:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300696735177

KAMATZ TACHOMETER 500 MEN'S WATCH


 


The Kamatz Paris Limited edition "Pilot" model Tachometer 500 is a 15-jewel watch, full working Triple Chronograph with quartz analog movement. It was made in a Yema factory for Kamatz. Only a limited number of these watches were made.

It has Tachometers of 1/5th of a second, 30 minute, and 12 hour, timed chronograph, and day & date function window at 3:00 (days are in both French and English). It is water resistant to 10 atmospheres (330 feet) and has a directional ratcheted numbered outer bezel. Easy read dial, screw down locking crown with crown guards, and twin sealing gaskets. Screw back cover, solid stainless case, elegant embossed leather band.

 

Exceptionally Handsome Men's Quartz Chronograph. Superb Sports Watch with Very Strong all Stainless Steel Case.

Impact resistant mineral crystal. Professional ratcheting two-tone bezel. Screw down Crown for safety and security.

Split second and lap time chronograph for competition timing. Incredibly Water Resistant to 300 feet. Inset Tachometer Ring. Three pushers for Chrono function. Three subsidiary dials. Regular second, minute and hour hands. Day and date indicators. Deluxe, heavy, fine leather band in Black. A very handsome watch. Made by 'Kamatz of Paris'.

Manufacturers List Price $695.00.


The seller has obviously copied the bulk of his description verbatim, off the 'Net - I suspect from this old post of mine on RLT:

http://www.thewatchforum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=62733&st=0&p=635205&#entry635205


Just one 'small' problem is that this particular watch is a model # 507000, which is the Ladies / Boys version. 

Ignoring the protusions around the pushers and crown, this is the smallest '7A38' made by any manufacturer. It's tiny.

Without getting mine out to check, off the top of my head, measured across the watch case, it's only 36mm in diameter.

The full-sized equivalent Men's version, model 517000 is 40mm across (and 20mm lug / strap width fitting, as opposed to 18mm).

You can gauge the proportions of this watch from the seller's second photo. The movement backplate is a shade under 29mm Ø.

The way the size reduction was achieved, was by having minuscule sub-dials and the tachymeter scale printed on the dial plate, rather than being a separate plastic ring (as with the Men's model # 517000 version). The date window is right on the periphery of the dial.


Here's a couple of photos of the NOS Kamatz 507000 from my own collection (courtesy of David Spalding, who helped me acquire it):




For comparison, here's three photos of the equivalent Men's model # 517000 from an eBay listing in January 2010:




So, in conclusion - an unusual little 7A38 'divers' watch for the wife or girlfriend, but just a 'bit' on the small size for the fellas. 

As long as you know what you're buying. ;)


Caveat Emptor, Gentlemen, as always. 


April 17, 2012 at 5:50 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

Somebody must have pointed out his error to the eBay seller, because he's since amended both his listing title and description. 

See: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemRevisionDetails&_trksid=p4340.l2569&rt=nc&item=300696735177


Title now reads:

KAMATZ TACHOMETER 500 WATCH (no MAN's)


And a line of description has also been added: 

For auction is a Kamatz Limited edition Men's or Woman's watch.

Which isn't stricly true,  but ....


April 18, 2012 at 11:38 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

Needless to say, that auction ended with the item unsold.


Interestingly, overnight, a proper Men's version, Kamatz model # 517000 came up on eBay in the States and was promptly sold:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/380432597678

New Men's Kamatz Paris Tachymeter 500 Brown Leather Watch




Up for purchase here is a brand new, unused men's Kamatz Paris watch. We know nothing about this brand but it's a beautiful watch. My boyfriend received this as a gift about 3 years ago and never wore it. It comes in a white box and would make a beautiful gift. It has brown leather band and has a silver with gold accents on the bezel and face. Beautiful looking watch ....


Sold for $49 (approx. £30.44). Looks like someone was in the right place at the right time, and bagged themselves a bargain. ;)


April 24, 2012 at 5:43 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

Seiko7A38 at April 18, 2012 at 11:38 AM

Somebody must have pointed out his error to the eBay seller, because he's since amended both his listing title and description. 

See: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemRevisionDetails&_trksid=p4340.l2569&rt=nc&item=300696735177


Title now reads:

KAMATZ TACHOMETER 500 WATCH (no MAN's)


And a line of description has also been added: 

For auction is a Kamatz Limited edition Men's or Woman's watch.

Which isn't stricly true,  but ....



It's back again: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300746943741 

KAMATZ RARE WATCH TACHOMETER 500 - this time, with a couple of new photos, besides the original three.


The revised description now includes: The size of the case is 35mm. The measurment from Lug to log is 42mm. (sic)


July 25, 2012 at 7:23 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

I think we can now safely draw a line under this one. :)

That Ladies Kamatz model # 507000 didn't sell that time around either, nor the next time, nor the next time the seller re-listed it.


But the third time he re-listed it - it finally sold on 11th August, for $71 - to someone who presumably knew what they were buying.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300756255627


Because, less than a week after that, 'Northdock' posted this in reply to a thread on SCWF:

http://www.thewatchsite.com/21-japanese-watch-discussion-forum/33200-yema-7a38.html#post216394


Yema also put 7A38's in watches for others as evidenced by this his and hers Kamatz's




Which, with hindsight, is probably the ideal photo to illustrate this thread - one that I should have taken myself in the first place. :/

The ladies Kamatz model # 507000 on the right obviously being one and the same watch, as was first listed on eBay in mid-April. ;)


August 20, 2012 at 8:22 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

And another Ladies Kamatz 507000 masquerading as a 'Mens' chronograph. 

Listed on eBay in the States overnight: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300844404804

This is a very good looking, handsome watch 

35mm size  

Exceptional Men's Quartz Chronograph.Superb Sports Watch with Stainless Steel Case. 

Impact resistant mineral crystal. Professional ratcheting two-tone bezel. Screw down Crown for safety and security. 

Split second and lap time chronograph for competition timing. Water Resistant to 300 feet. Inset Tachometer Ring. 

Three pushers for Chrono function. Three subsidiary dials. Regular second, minute and hour hands. Day and date indicators. 

Made by 'Kamatz of Paris'.  

Retail over $300 dollars


Exceptionally small 'Mens' I'd say. :roll:


January 9, 2013 at 6:23 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

This isn't much good as a comparison shot - other than you can see the larger proportions of the sub-dials (relative to the day / date windows) and the separate Tachymeter ring, but here's the equivalent Men's model # 517000 (from an eBay listing in February 2011):




As you can see from the eBay seller's last 'palm shot', it's comparatively tiny - 7A38's don't come any smaller than the Kamatz 507000.


January 9, 2013 at 6:59 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

Here's another 'gender bender' Ladies / Boys Kamatz maquerading as a Mens watch, listed on eBay in the States at the weekend:


http://www.ebay.com/itm/261680302870


Offered for auction, this Mens Kamatz wristwatch.

This is part of a large collection of watches I recently acquired at an estate auction.

Please note, I am not an expert on watches in any way.

I do not know the history of this watch, getting it serviced is highly recommended.

Needs a battery, running condition unknown, battery compartment is clean. 

The movement is marked Shimauchi Ltd 15 Jewels unadjusted. 

The crystal has one small scratch the case has light scratches, overall very clean.

Please see photos for complete condition details. 

Comes as shown with a nice black leather band. 

The case measures: 36mm (crown excluded) x 42mm(lug to lug).

The face measures 24mm.

Thanks for looking, please check out my other auctions for more great wristwatches.


Not hard to spot, if you know what you're looking at (versus the real Mens version), but the misleading title may catch someone out.


December 1, 2014 at 12:30 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

Gender reassigned. 


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemRevisionDetails&item=261680302870




December 2, 2014 at 5:55 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

Some 4 years on since my last post, it's time for a belated postscript to this thread.

I have an admission to make. 


There have been a couple more Kamatz model # 507000 Boy's / Ladies versions listed by eBay sellers in the intervening years, but they were correctly described as such. I've commented on both of them in the Yema N7's and N8's Spotted thread. One was in March 2015, see top of page 14 and the other, a 'Baby Panda' (which I bought quite cheaply) was in September 2016 towards the bottom of page 20.


As some readers may have guessed from recent posts in the WRUW thread and elsewhere, I've been on a bit of a Kamatz buying spree lately. I've even succumbed to a bit of 'gender bending' and bought yet another 507000 Boys / Ladies version. As it transpires, it's the very same watch that was subject of my 2 previous posts, back in December 2014.


I hadn't bothered posting them before, but here, better late than never, are the seller's photos from that US eBay listing at the end of November 2014:




An observation point (for later identification purposes) is that the watch is obviously fitted with a too narrow black leather strap - it's only a 16mm in an 18mm lug width.


I didn't make a note of how much it actually sold for (the eBay listing has long since disappeared into the ether), but I did know who won the auction and bought it. Over the last couple of years I've been in correspondence with a US collector, Chuck Lowe. In fact I'd known of him (or at least knew his eBay ID) since 2009, when he first started amassing his sizeable collection of Kamatz's. Back in March 2016, Chuck emailed me a series of photos, including this one of three 507000's:




That's the same watch on the left of this trio. In fact, I'd already bought the other two 507000's in the photo, from Chuck, as part of an amazing 'job lot' deal. Don was my accomplice at the time, but I've since ended up buying his Kamatz's off him. :roll:


Until recently, Chuck had held onto a couple of his Kamatz's, including the 507000 'Reverse Panda' - that was till last month when he finally listed it on eBay.



As can be seen from his two eBay listing photos, it's still fitted with that same (too narrow) 16mm black leather strap, which appears to have been little worn since he bought it. (The case-back has a few more light scratches from battery changes.)


I'd never really ever intended to buy more than one of these small Boys / Ladies versions, but somehow I'd managed to end up with 4 of them already. Indeed, by now I'd acquired an example of nearly all the known 507000 dial colour variants - apart from the 'Reverse Panda', so I decided to buy it to 'complete the set'. :roll:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/143148405736

Despite the fact that we'd been trading emails for years - and that he knew I was in England, Chuck set the eBay listing up as CONUS shipping only. So once again, I had to enlist the services of my ever-obliging US forwarding agent - Paul (PHK) in Las Vegas. Paul's package (containing 2 'Fugly watches') arrived mid-week. ;)


A few Kamatz's in my collection, including my first NOS 507000 (see photos higher up the page) came fitted with their original leather straps. That said, it's sometimes difficult to determine what actually constitutes 'original'. Kamatz appear to have fitted a variety of different (other OEM) straps to their watches - including Russian made Poljot straps of 'cardboard consistency'. Where the original straps were too grubby or worn to consider re-using, I've usually fitted a cheap substitute padded oiled leather strap from UK eBay seller WSD. See link. I'd ordered a couple of 18mm Black straps on Wednesday, hoping they'd arrive in time for this weekend. They didn't - nothing came in this morning's post, other than junk mail. :(


Indeed those two straps I'd ordered never did arrive. I complained to the seller, who sent me two more, as replacements, which finally arrived the following weekend.

So I guess all it needs to finish off this thread, once and for all, is ....


March 16, 2019 at 10:55 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11495

Seiko7A38 at August 20, 2012 at 8:22 PM

I think we can now safely draw a line under this one. :)



 

Which, with hindsight, is probably the ideal photo to illustrate this thread - one that I should have taken myself in the first place. :/


So, better late than never .... :P

Here are a couple of my own side-by-side 'His and Hers' size comparison shots of 2 pairs of Kamatz's (amongst a few of the 517000 and 507000's I've fetted recently):

March 26, 2019 at 6:13 AM Flag Quote & Reply

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