Seiko 7A38 - by the numbers

Forums

Post Reply
Forum Home > Non-Seiko 7Axx Discussion Area (Re-branded mvmt's) > 'Missing' Puma Y19 spotted by Hungarian 7A38 enthusiast !

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 8885

.... and I'm not referring to Arpad. ;)


I guess I've been fortunate to have amassed an eclectic all-encompassing collection of Orient J39 and Puma Y19 '7A38's over the last three years. They may not all be in pristine condition; some far from it, but none were exactly expensive - particularly when compared to equivalent Seiko 7A38's of equal 'rarity factor'. I don't even really mind that much if there are one or two 'gaps' in my collection. :/

But what does bug the hell out of me is not knowing what I might be missing. :mad:


Some of you may have seen my little Orient / Puma 'knowledge database' Excel spreadsheet, which I included in another thread:



January 25, 2013 at 4:55 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 8885

Most of the information included in the spreadsheet has been gained by my actually owning the watches.

Some of it was verified when I discovered the Boley.de's case parts database. IIRC, at the time I found this table, back in May 2012 ....


http://www.boley.de/en/case-parts/orient?search=y19



.... I didn't yet own my Y19301-70 beater, so it helped me to identify it when I first saw one listed on eBay Germany, in the same month:



It also presented me with something of an enigma - a niggling gap in my 'knowledge database'.

I already knew what the other Puma Y19 variants looked like (indeed owned doubles of one). But what the heck was the Y19904-50 ??


January 25, 2013 at 5:05 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 8885

Even today, if you google 'Puma Y19904-50', the only meaningful result you'll find is still just the Boley.de case parts database search.


But of course, we already know of the Orient J3920 / Puma / JEPIC Corp. Y19 relationship, good as proven by my findings here:

http://www.seiko7a38.com/apps/forums/topics/show/7997030-the-tacit-seiko-7a38-orient-j3920-puma-jepic-y19-connection


Earlier this evening, I just happened to google 'Orient J3920' (as you do) - and for once found a new result on the second page:

Hungarian though - it might as well all be Greek to me. But I thought I'd have a quick look, as it was a thread about Japanese watches. 

Currently halfway down the first page is this post by 'steve31': http://forum.index.hu/Article/viewArticle?a=123178326&t=9198082

Most of the images look fairly familiar (including the wrist shot of my Orient J39909-80) and were probably borrowed from this site ....

Apart from these three:



So there you have it - that's how a Puma Y19904-50 looks. No suprises really - quite like a dressy Orient J39. It's just nice to know. :D


January 25, 2013 at 5:21 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 8885

Scrolling (backwards) through that thread on forum.index.hu; it's a L-O-N-G thread, currently 99 pages long, and reads back to front,

.... I found this post (currently) on page 22: http://forum.index.hu/Article/viewArticle?a=117654956&t=9198082

It would appear that Puma Y19904-50 (or one very similar to it) was listed on Hungary's equivalent of eBay, Vatera.hu in April 2012:




Needless to say, the actual listing has long since dropped off history, but at least someone thought to save the image. :)


January 25, 2013 at 6:31 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 8885

That'll teach me, posting late at night, slightly under the influence. I seem to have missed the absolutely bl**dy obvious. 

Google didn't translate Steve's post particularly well (that's my excuse :P ) but it was clear he'd made the Orient / JEPIC connection.

Looking more closely at his photo of the movement in his Puma Y19904-50, in the broad light of day, the reason becomes apparent:



It isn't Stamped JEPIC CORP. and Y19, as one would expect (please excuse the horrible photo below - it's one I had prepared earlier):




Instead, his Puma Y19904-50's movement is stamped J3920 above the battery on the right hand side, where I'd expect to see Y19.

I strongly suspect this isn't a manufacturing deviation by Orient Watch Co. / JEPIC CORP., but that he's swapped the movement.

Specifically, from this tired-looking Orient J39701-70 which was listed on Vatera.hu back in July last year:



Apart from the broken finger tension spring, some of the tarnish marks on the movement's back-plates are a perfect match.

January 26, 2013 at 7:15 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 8885

My apologies to Steve. ;)

Seems it was not actually he himself who had swapped over the movements bewteen the Orient J39701-70 and this Puma Y19904-50.

See his post reply on forum.index.hu: http://forum.index.hu/Article/viewArticle?a=123565879&t=9198082

 

After I read your description I noticed that in my watch the movement probably was changed.

The seller wasn't honest when asked for about the watch.


January 27, 2013 at 5:47 AM Flag Quote & Reply

stewe31
Member
Posts: 6

Seiko7A38 at January 27, 2013 at 5:47 AM

My apologies to Steve. ;)

Seems it was not actually he himself who had swapped over the movements bewteen the Orient J39701-70 and this Puma Y19904-50.

See his post reply on forum.index.hu: http://forum.index.hu/Article/viewArticle?a=123565879&t=9198082

 

After I read your description I noticed that in my watch the movement probably was changed.

The seller wasn't honest when asked for about the watch.


Hello! :)

It was very interesting to read about my watch and our conversation.

Actually I sold this Puma watch after I had information about the wrong movements (we discussed it).

Last month I managed to buy an "original" Seiko 7A38 chrono to my collection and now I don't cry for that Puma watch. :)

(steve31)


May 19, 2014 at 6:44 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 8885

Now that is what you call bumping an old thread, Steve ! :D Good to see you posting on here at last. ;)


Well you may not miss that Puma Y19904-50 :/ - it may have been a bit gaudy (and fitted with the wrong Orient J3920 movement) ....

but I would, if it had been mine. They're very rare; much rarer than many Seiko 7A38's - and yours is still the only one I've ever seen.


May 19, 2014 at 7:35 AM Flag Quote & Reply

stewe31
Member
Posts: 6

Seiko7A38 at May 19, 2014 at 7:35 AM

Now that is what you call bumping an old thread, Steve ! :D Good to see you posting on here at last. ;)


Well you may not miss that Puma Y19904-50 :/ - it may have been a bit gaudy (and fitted with the wrong Orient J3920 movement) ....

but I would, if it had been mine. They're very rare; much rarer than many Seiko 7A38's - and yours is still the only one I've ever seen.


I believe that it was rare but I don't like non-original watches. Nowadays I'm more careful before buying a watch.

If I had enough time later I will show my 7A38-7270 in the right topic. (all parts are original :) )

May 20, 2014 at 9:00 AM Flag Quote & Reply

You must login to post.