Seiko 7A38 - by the numbers

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Forum Home > eBay, LeBonCoin, Mercado Libre, Yahoo Japan, etc. > Heads Up on yet another 7A38 Franken(s) - Part 2 !!

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Slightly for this forum section, but I thought it wouldn't hurt to post it here and link it to the other forum section thread. ;)

For those of you who browse Other Watch Forum's Sales Corners be careful of this one offered FS on Orologi & Passioni:


http://orologi.forumfree.it/?t=67859074


Vendo Seiko 7A38 - 7280


It's a Franken: a stainless 7A38-7280 fitted with the all-black 722L dial, Tachymeter ring and bezel from a stainless 7A38-7270.


Apart from the bracelet being somewhat badly re-finished - note the centre links aren't polished as they should be on a p/n B1627 bracelet, the whole thing has been rather heavily rebrushed - it's an undeniably attractive little 7A38 (for a Franken combination).


Bound to catch somebody else out second time around. 

For more detail and the watch's history see: http://www.seiko7a38.com/apps/forums/topics/show/7609906


February 8, 2014 at 10:39 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

I guess it's about time I resurrected this thread. Or perhaps I should sub-title this post ....

Heads Up on yet another 7A48 Franken(s) - Part 2 !! .... Because that's what this deceptively described watch is.


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/251490625750

Seiko 7A38-7289

Two tone chronograph. White dial. This is part of the 7A series that were the worlds first quartz analog chronographs. It is quite a movement with no plastic parts and 4 separate motors. This movement is made to last a lifetime. It is well used, but has a new battery and works great.

The crystal has a couple scratches with a noticeable one at 7:00. 

It is not altered. It is on it's original bracelet.  total B/S. 

The bracelet will fit up to 8" with 5 removable links and a 7 hole clasp.

The brushed finish has been lightly polished. Not by me! Not to much and mostly on the bracelet.

I didn't notice it at first but the clasp caught my attention with it being too shiny.

The watch measures 38 mm not including the crown, with 18mm lugs.


Not too difficult (for us old hands) to recognise it's true origins, being the watch case and p/n Z1093C bracelet of a 7A48-7000 / -7009, that's been well polished, fitted with the 'White Roman' 724O dial / movement and scratched-up case-back from a two-tone 7A38-7289.




The obvious clue to it being a complete 'wrong un' being the duplicated sets of Roman numerals on the dial and dial ring.

But that apart, it looks an attractive watch. It's also priced to sell at $125, so I'm sure it'll find an inexperienced buyer fairly quickly. :roll:


March 29, 2014 at 8:20 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

From the seller's given location of Meridian, Idaho, United States, I have a strong suspicion that eBay seller Starsinthedirt and recently joined forum member TimeTracker are one and the same person. Well, I don't have a problem calling a spade a spade. :P


March 29, 2014 at 9:45 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

I notice that the would-be seller has since amended his description slightly:


http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemRevisionDetails&item=251490625750



It is not altered. has been removed, but It is on it's original bracelet. remains ....

Which I guess is technically correct - if you're talking about the original 7A48-7000 / -7009 case and it's p/n Z1093C bracelet. 


March 30, 2014 at 7:05 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

I note, with some satisfaction, that both title and description of that 7A38 / 7A48 Franken listing have since been further amended:


http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemRevisionDetails&item=251490625750






Seiko 7A38 

The case back reads 7A38-7289 but I have been told the movement is not correct for this watch.

Still a great watch to wear. Or maybe a good source of parts, but it is not a good collector piece.


I'll go along with that ! :roll:


March 30, 2014 at 12:38 PM Flag Quote & Reply

PHK
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Posts: 249

Mine now!

PK 8)

April 3, 2014 at 7:40 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

I didn't like to say before, Paul - but apart from the duplication of the Roman numerals, it wasn't a bad looking 7Axx - for a Franken. :P


April 3, 2014 at 8:06 AM Flag Quote & Reply

PHK
Member
Posts: 249

That movement will replace the knackered movement in a 7A38-7060. So... Franken to Franken. I just like lugged cases.

(might have a lovely 7A48 case and bracelet left over!)

Paul, awaiting the Sunrise in LV. 8)


April 3, 2014 at 8:24 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11897

This far from original 'rare' mish-mash, purporting to be a 7A38-702A was listed on eBay by UK seller 8472karen about an hour ago:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201084592663



RARE SEIKO 100 M SPORTS CHRONOGRAPH IN GOOD USED CONDITION AND IN FULL WORKING ORDER GOLD PLATED BEZEL HAS SLIGHT WEAR AS YOU WOULD EXPECT DUE TO ITS AGE AND THE CRYSTAL GLASS ALSO HAS QUITE A FEW FINE SCRATCHES ON DUE TO BEING WORN REGULAR. THESE ARE BECOMING VERY COLLECTIBLE. PLEASE ASK ANY QUESTIONS IF NEEDED.


O.K. Here's my question: Why are you trying to pass off this hastily cobbled together piece of junk as a RARE 7A38-702A ? :P


The watch case, gold-plated bezel and gold Tachymeter ring are presumably from the original 7A38-702A. The light grey 703L dial is from the 7A38-7020. The hereto unidentified bracelet is a non-original 10mm fitment Seiko band - but it's not the usual p/n Z1357S.


Here's what a 7A38-702A and a two-tone 7A38-7020 should look like - both fitted with the original p/n B1171C bracelet:


May 4, 2014 at 7:03 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Funny thing, that - 8 hours later and the seller is making lots of changes to their listing. 


http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemRevisionDetails&item=201084592663



So it currently  looks like this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201084592663



RARE SEIKO 100 M SPORTS CHRONOGRAPH IN GOOD USED CONDITION AND IN FULL WORKING ORDER GOLD PLATED BEZEL HAS SLIGHT WEAR AS YOU WOULD EXPECT DUE TO ITS AGE AND THE CRYSTAL GLASS ALSO HAS QUITE A FEW FINE SCRATCHES ON DUE TO BEING WORN REGULAR. I DONT THINK THE BRACELET IS THE ORIGINAL BUT IS A GENUINE SEIKO. THESE ARE BECOMING VERY COLLECTIBLE.

PLEASE ASK ANY QUESTIONS IF NEEDED.

My next question would be: why haven't you included the 'F' word ? - 'cos that's exactly what this is - a 'Franken-watch'. 


May 4, 2014 at 3:18 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Just scanning through my eBay watching list and noticed the price on that 7A38-702x Franken had been reduced once again. 


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201084592663

May 6, 2014 at 11:31 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11897

Perhaps this post should be sub-titled: Heads Up on another 2x 7A38 Frankens ! :roll:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321419426983


Selling 2 Seiko 7A38

One is working perfectly.

The other one is missing the tachymeter ring and is not working.


What the seller (who is actually member of this forum) has omitted to mention is that both watches are cobbled together Frankens ! 


May 31, 2014 at 5:44 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

At first, one appears to be built using the watch case from a stainless 7A38-7020 / -7029, fitted with the p/n B1171C two-tone bracelet from a 7A38-7020 (or 7A38-702A / H) and the all-black 722L dial (and possibly also the Tachymeter ring) from a stainless 7A38-7270.




But strike that, there's evidence of gold plating left on the (stripped) bezel and pushers. :roll:




Indeed it's fitted with the case-back from that stainless 7A38-7270 which donated the dial.




The other non-working 'thing' comprises what's left of the donor stainless 7A38-7270 - in the form of its watch case and bracelet ....




Fitted with the 700L dial from a stainless 7A38-7000, but minus the 7A38-7270's Tachymeter ring (the 7A38-7000's wouldn't fit) ....




.... and capped off with an 'unidentified' non-Seiko case-back that looks all too familiar. 


May 31, 2014 at 5:56 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Here's the rub.

Between those two cobbled together messes, there are all the components needed to reconstruct the original stainless 7A38-7270.


In November last year, this same eBay seller offered a 'junk' 7A38 parts lot, which included a 703L gold dial (from a 7A38-702A/H) and a dismantled movement - plus an unrelated stainless 7A38-7000 watch case and bracelet without any (700L) dial and movement fitted.




Here's a copy and paste of my post from Page 7 of The lower end & bottom of the 7Axx barrel thread


Originally posted (by myself) November 26, 2013 at 11:48 AM

Looks like erstwhile forum member L'iffes (Yves) is trying to have a bit of a clear out. 

He listed this 7A38 Parts / Pieces lot, comprising the dismantled dial / movement of a 7A38-702A/H and partial stainless case / bracelet from a stainless 7A38-7000 on eBay a couple of weeks ago:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321241765817



I did have a little (lowball) punt at it myself. It sold for 25.50 Swiss Francs (approx. £17.30) after 7 bids.

Seems the winning bidder changed their mind (or welched on the transaction), because it's back again, re-listed today:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321260586900


Selling Parts of Seiko 7A38 

Golden Dial

Black Hands

Movement (not assembled) should work if assembled

Case (1 pusher missing) Not for this dial.


Better luck this time around, perhaps George ? ;)


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


In case you'd forgotten where we'd seen that distinctly non-Seiko radially numbered case-back, used on the second Franken before, I wrote about it in October last year on Page 2 of the Latest mis-matched hotch-potch 7Axx spotted on eBay / Yahoo.jp thread

Here's a copy and paste of that post:


Originally posted (by myself) on October 7, 2013 at 11:19 AM


The two-tone grey-dialed 7A38-7020, sales code SAA010J, is probably one of the models most often abused by watch-botchers.

Usually it's their favourite trick of polishing the remaining worn gold plating off the bezel. See the example higher up this page.

They frequently crop up on eBay Germany, where the model appears to have been a big seller, in varying conditions.

This tired-looking example, with upside-down Tachymeter ring, came up in my eBay saved favourite search notifications this morning:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/141083005660

Seiko Chronographen Sports 100 Calb. 7A38



The seller's description reads:

 

Ich biete einen Seiko Chronographen Sports 100 Calb. 7A38 zur Versteigerung an.

Die Uhr läuft gut. Schauen sie sich die Bilder an, sie sprechen für sich.

Zustand mit Gebrauchsspuren. Die Uhr ist aus meiner Privatsammlung.


Die Daten:

Kaliber 7A38 

Der Bodendeckel ist wohl nicht original.


Google translates the last short sentence as: The bottom cover is probably not original.




I'd say there's a very strong probability of that !! 


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I think I can now confidently state that there's also a very strong probability: it was Yves (L'iffes) who bought that piece of junk and has used most of it to produce the two current 7A38 frankens - along with some residuals from his previous clear-out of six months ago. 


To any readers, may I recommend that you avoid this latest 2 for 1 Franken / Junk B-O-G-O-F offering with extreme prejudice. 

To Yves - I suggest you give it up as a bad job, mate. Because let's face it, you're clearly not even very good at watch-botching. 


May 31, 2014 at 6:18 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Scammers trying to palm off mis-represented Franken 7Axx's are popping up everywhere nowadays. 

Not just on eBay, other watch forms' sales corners, Craigslist, Gumtree. You name it - they'll try it on.

I was browsing an Italian free classified site www.kijiji.it this morning and spotted this unusual advert:


http://www.kijiji.it/annunci/biciclette/milano-annunci-bicocca-greco-viale-monza/scambio-crono-seiko-con-city-bike/66269672



The Italian seller would like to swap this Seiko chrono' for a city bike. I honed in on the words Scambio and con.

At first glance it may look like a two-tone 7A38-7260, on a nice vintage ostrich strap - and it almost had me confused for a minute ....

But look closely at the dial and you'll see it's a 7210 SPORTS 150 dial out of a stainless 7A38-7130. The hands ? Anybody's guess ! 


Here's what the two donor watches look like:


July 25, 2014 at 7:05 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Heads up on yet another cobbled together mis-represented piece of franken junk from Filipino arch-watch-botchers jfm_watches ....

Or Nippontime, or Restoredwatches or whatever eBay ID he happens to be using currently:


Edit: Original listing, item # 311043335711 ended early after 2 days; subsequently re-listed: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/351143345412


Buy With Confidence - what a joke - more like confident in the knowledge that what you're buying isn't what it's supposed to be.

As indeed it isn't in this instance. Con(fidence) being the operative word. The case and bracelet are from a stainless 7A38-7060 ....

fitted with the Arabic numbered 7250 dial, hands, (hence presumably the movement) and case-back from a gold-tone 7A38-7280.


Look closely at the seller's tiny photo of the case-back and you can just make out: BASE METAL ST. STEEL BACK.




Here's what the original stainless 7A38-7060 and gold-tone 7A38-7280 donor watches would have once looked like:


August 9, 2014 at 2:38 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Some people have short memories. Unfortunately for NY-based would-be profiteering re-seller brycen42112 I'm not one of them. :P

As soon as I clapped eyes on this allegedly Real Nice Vintage Seiko 7A38-7280 Franken I knew where I'd seen it not long too ago:


http://www.ebay.com/itm/181547437601




UP FOR SALE IS A VINTAGE SEIKO QUARTZ CHRONOGRAPH WITH THE POPULAR 7A28 7A38 MOVEMENT. THIS IS A RARE MODEL WHICH I HAVE NOT SEEN AROUND ON EBAY. THE CASE AND BAND ARE CLEAN, THE CRYSTAL IS CLEAR OF SCRATCHES, FRESH BATTERY PLACED IN IT. KEEPS PERFECT TIME. THE CHRONOGRAPH NEEDS SOME ADJUSTMENT BECAUSE THE RIGHT SUB DIAL DOES NOT RESET TO ZERO. 

VERY NICE DAY DATE COMBO. DONT MISS OUT, LOW BUY NOW PRICE.


Nope, I must admit - I've only ever seen this particular Franken 'combo' on eBay once twice before myself - as nearly knocked out twice by Filipino arch-watch-botcher jfm_watches back in August - see the detail my previous post.


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/311043335711


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/351143345412



And if after reading this, you're fool enough to pay more than $1 for this cobbled together piece of junk - then more fool you. :roll:


October 4, 2014 at 12:55 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11897

This reasonably attractive (in a blingy sort of way) little 7Axx Franken 'Special', in need of D-I-Y repair, listed earlier today by a German eBay seller raised a smile. It's obviously based on a 7A34-7019 gold-tone salesman's sample case and almost full bracelet, of which there have been a few on eBay lately, (fitted by the seller with a generic aftermarket clasp) and using the dial / movement and also the case-back from a donor gold-tone 7A38-728A 'beater' - the remains of which come as part of the deal:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221592924858



Zum Verkauf kommt ein 7A38 Chrono

 

verbaut in einem 7A34 Mustergehäuse mit universeller Schließe (nicht von Seiko)

 

Das Werk läuft, Uhrzeit und Datum funktioniert - aber eine Revision ist nötig, weil die Zentralsekunde, im Stopuhrbetrieb, stellenweise "hängt"

 

Batteriewechsel steht an -> aktuell 2 Sekundenschritte bei der Uhrzeit und im Stoppuhrbetrieb (das ist die vorgesehene Anzeige von Seiko dafür)

 

Wer dieses Angebot gefunden hat, ist sicherlich Sammler oder Hobbyuhrmacher und kennt den Wert für ein funktionierendes Spenderuhrwerk.

 

Deshalb sollte dieses Angebot auch bitte nur mit Vintage Erfahrung genutzt werden.

 

Ich möchte keinen Käufer enttäuschen, der eigentlich eine neue Uhr sucht und Microkratzer bei einer über 30 Jahre alten Uhr reklamiert.

 

Das Spendergehäuse kommt natürlich mit, darin ist auch die Krone, Ziffernblatt und Zeiger der 7A34 enthalten.

 

Bitte Bilder als Teil der Beschreibung betrachten (und dies nicht nur auf dem Smartphone!)

 

Danke für das Interesse und viel Erfolg bei 3,2,1...


It's a pity that the seller, who I assume was the constructor, didn't have the wherewithal to sort the recalcitrant centre seconds chrono' hand problem. :roll: Might make a nice quick little fixer-upper project for a capable forum member. How about it, George ? ;)


November 2, 2014 at 2:54 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
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Posts: 11897

Strange - some of the half-arsed efforts you'll see at passing off a 7A38 Franken. Makes you wonder why the seller even bothers to list his failed attempt. Not only is this incompetent Spanish watch-botcher incapable of replacing a badly scratched crystal, but by his own admission, he can't even align a Tachymeter ring properly. :roll:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/161597687413

 

Seiko crono funcionando correctamente, botonera y corona en perfecto estado,cristal en sus bordes, como se muestra en las fotos, muestra signos de uso,reseteo de agujas ok, el dial de taquimetro esta desplazado como se observa en las fotos.

 

In case you didn't recognize it, the gold 701L dial that's been dropped into this 7A38-7240 case is from a gold-tone 7A38-7000.

The non-original bracelet is off a much later Seiko model. For the uninitiated, here's what the orginal donor watches should look like:



February 12, 2015 at 5:54 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Seiko7A38
Site Owner
Posts: 11897

Listed a couple of hours ago by italian eBay seller cogglufi (whose ID seems to ring a bell - but for the wrong reasons) ....

Spot the deliberate mistake. :roll:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181686373785


VENDO OROLOGIO MARCHIO "SEIKO" MODELLO SPORT 100 QUARTZ 7A38 702A. MOVIMENTO FUNZIONANTE. IL CRONOGRAFO NON FUNZIONA, PULSANTI DA PULIRE. OROLOGIO USATO, CHE PRESENTA DEI GRAFFI SUL VETRO E SUL RESTANTE DELLE PARTI. BRACCIALE ORIGINALE

  

SELL BRAND WATCH "SEIKO" SPORT MODEL 100 QUARTZ 7A38 702A. MOVEMENT WORKING. THE CHRONOGRAPH NOT WORK, BUTTONS TO CLEAN. WATCH USED, PRESENTING THE SCRATCHES ON THE GLASS AND THE REST OF THE PARTIES. ORIGINAL BRACELET

I wonder if the moonphase works ? 


March 9, 2015 at 4:29 PM Flag Quote & Reply

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